Request for information on Dec 1944 17th SS

[Hans]

Division

Anyone have info as to what types of equipment this unit was using at this time? I'm building a historic scenario that refers to the unit attacking with, "Tanks and SPs".

Also any info on the German 36th Division at the same time and in particular the 5th Company 165th Regiment?

Thanks

[Vixen]

This *might* be able to help.

http://www.feldgrau.com/

[Hans]

Thanks Vixen I had that source, need to figure out what type of SP and tanks this unit was using while defending the Saar

[Vixen]

http://www.100thww2.org/gerunit/17.html

Looks like Jagdtigers were attached and it says in small print there was also 90 assualt guns....I would guess StuG's but it doesn't specify.

[Hans]

Well done Vixen, that's the info I needed, now how come google wouldn't find that!

Yikes Jaghtigers....that'll throw the balance out to heck.

Hans

[Berlichtingen]

Something you might find helpful...

The 17th's PG battalions were made up almost entirely of Soviet POWs. German officers, of course, but the rank and file were Russians. The fighting quality of the unit's infantry was very low.

[Hans]

Berlichtingen! Hey I would suspect you'd know about this unit as its other name was, Gotz von Berlichingen!

That is a very interesting note. In the history of the 134th they don't mention this. The 9th Company 38th PG Regiment and 3rd Company 37th Regiment were mentioned, but not the Russianification.

Were these Russians of German or other ethnic stock or Slavic Russians?

Thanks for the info!

Oh and for Vixen, Drat! not Jagdtigers in CMAK so a lowly Jagdpanther will have to do....

[Berlichtingen]

I got the info direct from Keith Bonn (author of When the Odds Were Even) when I was researching Nordwind

The Russians were literally POWs that were given the choice of being worked to death as slave labor or fight for the Reich and possibly live. The ethic stock was likely mixed.

As for the Jagdtigers, IIRC they joined the division for Nordwind, and wouldn't be available prior to January 45. Also, I suspect that the majority of assault guns would be Marders rather than StuGs, but I don't have any hard evidence to support that

[Hans]

Thanks for the info Berl

I found another source that suggested these guys might be Volksdeutsche from Russia and other places in the East.

Thanks for the note on the equipment